7th July 2009
Defending the Indefensible?
This from teletext:
Welsh Secretary Peter Hain said an inquiry had shown spending in Wales compared well with English regions.
Speaking after the Holtham Commission report, Mr Hain said the Barnett formula had not disadvantaged Wales.
He added: “I do note (the report) points to concerns over the potential future convergence downsides. We want to keep this under consideration.”"
And this from the actual Holtham Commission Report:
“Our analysis has shown that Wales currently receives less than it would were it to be funded by the UK Government using the formulae it applies to England.”
Disagreeing with the Holtham Commission is one thing….but misrepresenting its findings is surely another. Maybe Peter himself has been misrepresented….
Let’s face facts: the biggest ever inquiry into the workings of the Barnett Formula in Wales has just confirmed what many of us have always argued: that Wales is losing out to the tune of hundreds of millions. The debate now needs to move on to what we do about it: this could be Peter Hain’s legacy. Drop the spin, Peter and seize the opportunity.
6 Responses to “Defending the Indefensible?”
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alanindyfed says:
July 7th, 2009 at 6:17 pm
Misrepresenting the facts to gain political advantage is endemic in Labour’s vain and deceitful strategy to become re-elected into government.
Peter Hain is not the only minister adept at these manoeuvres.
marcscaife says:
July 9th, 2009 at 1:12 am
Come on then Adam – enlighten us – how much money do you actually want from the Barnett formula?
Marc
Gav says:
July 9th, 2009 at 2:48 pm
Marc the Holtham report states that Wales will lose out to the tune of £8.5bn over the next ten years alone. I imagine that Adam and anyone else for that matter would start by wanting that. What I support is a needs based formula. At present we are not getting what Wales needs nor deserves.
why don’t you enlighten us on why you think the Barnett formula is good for wales? Or even still is not a disadvantage for Wales given what this report clearly states.
marcscaife says:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:41 pm
Dear Gav,
Whilst I agree that the Barnett formula does need addressing, there is a real danger in opening this debate – we could actually get less than the current £9.1Bn because there are already many regional English MP’s querying why expenditure per capita in Wales is higher than in their constituencies when our needs are similar.
Surely Adam’s answer to the question would be £0.00 because that is what we would get if we were independent from the United Kingdom as he envisages.
Regards,
Marc
Gav says:
July 16th, 2009 at 10:28 am
Marc,
The fact of the matter is that the Holtham report has stated that Wales is loosing out and that we are expected to lose out to the tune of £8.5 Billion over the next decade. Are you seriously going to follow the Peter Hain line that we shouldn’t address that staggering loss because English MPs are unhappy. Clearly you do follow the line of being subservient to London rather than standing up for Wales.
As for Adam we are discussing the Barnett formula which would not be in effect under an independent Wales. Whilst it is in effect I would imagine that Adam, like many others including me, is not prepared to settle for the Labour line that it is acceptable for Wales to lose out on billions of pounds. Under an independent Wales, Welsh taxes for a start would not be given to the English tresury. I am suprised that you think we would still be giving money across the boarder and get nothing in return. Sadly Marc I belive you are going down the tried and failed tactic of a New Labour politician which is to try and confuse the Barnett formula with independence. the fact is that the current way in which Wales is funded has been proven to restrict Wales by billions. Sadly you seem to support peter hains comments that it is ok for wales to lose out as you do not want to rock the boat for Gordon Brown.
marcscaife says:
July 16th, 2009 at 5:45 pm
Dear Gav,
If you read my reply I concur that the Barnett formula does need addressing – as indicated in the Holtham report – it is currently assessed per capita and should be based on need. However we must realise that this £9.1Bn that we receive is a top up to Welsh taxation revenue – and it is arbitrary!
I assume from your line of debate that you are a Plaid supporter, and yes you’ve guessed it I am New Labour.
I do not accept your argument that we are confusing the Barnett formula with independence – they are directly linked – if we choose independence we will be turning down this £9.1Bn subsidy with no other means of raising similar revenue.
Projecting further – what other revenue would we lose if we follow your plans? European? Income from UK civil service jobs based in Wales? And what about S4C, currently funded by Westminster; under your proposals our only welsh medium channel would surely be an early casualty?
Your jingoistic proposals will destroy our economy our culture and our language – I cannot stand idly by and let this happen. As a Welsh patriot I am certainly standing up for Wales.
Regards,
Marc